<< /Length 5 0 R /Filter /FlateDecode >> The "D.D. Collings Hadelin
Mark for optional superior provisional proof. Reply rdlowe Pilgrim Joined Dec 11, 2015 Messages 236 Reaction score 190 Location Dallas TX Dec 21, 2018 #3 curator said: The book
Well the bore is noted in the rhombus as >>12<< and the constriction values are >>18.2/18.2<< & >>17.3/18.2<< so with those it has to be a 12 bore. http://sites.google.com/a/damascusknowl m/www/home, https://www.hunting.be/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/Belgian-Proof-Marks.pdf, Belgian Liege gunmakers (A to C) - Volume 1, https://docs.google.com/document/d/17yC Xntqw/edit, https://www.dropbox.com/sc/0sf7osf1dtg1s3r/AABKOd3k4GaQV_ppAci4eWNka, https://books.google.com/books?id=5fxGA g=PA52&lpg, http://www.cip-bobp.org/homologation/en _type_id=7, https://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewto 5&t=471622, https://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewto 5&t=474548, https://books.google.com/books?id=5fxGAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA53, http://www.littlegun.be/arme%20belge/ar a%20gb.htm, https://www.cornellpubs.com/old-guns/it em_id=3618, https://www.cornellpubs.com/old-guns/it em_id=3202. By 1931, Fabrique Nationale d'Armes de Guerre in Herstal, Belgium (FN) launched an even smaller .25 ACP pistol developed by the company's chief designer, Dieudonn Saive. Any maker's name on the rib between the barrels?Best,Gerry, 1902 a greener twobarrel it has hh on botten of barrel what do i have. The IZh motorcycles and automobiles are manufactured by. cases. In 1888 it was decided by a joint meeting of the Gunmakers Company and the Birmingham Guardians that a new supplementary proof for smokeless powder should be instituted in 1893, 1896, and 1904; the rules were further adjusted to allow for new powders. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Comblain Hubert Joseph
We now have 1689 serial numbers!. Bischop Pierre
Mauser was a late entry in 1888. Side by side shotguns of this era are highly collectable and our inventory changes frequently. The Ask the Pros & What's It Worth? Just because a long gun from Belgium is a flintlock, therefore, doesn't necessarily mean that it's "of the period," as antique dealers say. Can you send me some, Ed? Category:Firearm manufacturers of Belgium - Wikipedia Category:Firearm manufacturers of Belgium Help Belgium portal Aggregate of articles pertaining to firearms manufacturers in Belgium . Thanks Brandon. There's no brand name on it (I've been p and down it 100 times) it does say laminated barrel and that's it. Very long barrel. 1860-1870. Prices: side-by-side, from 53,000 + VAT; over-and-under, from 65,000 + VAT. Ancion Marx
No maker's name anywhere? So I'd guess it was made in the late 1800's. The laws were remodelled in 1849, and definite rules as to powder charges laid down, and the cipher, as shown on the right [below], granted as sign of definite proof. Length of chamber over diameter of chamber. (most sales were in the 1930s). Christophe & Montigny
The famous "hump back" was made in countless configurations and gauges. The system of proof in Great Britain was as follows: In England, the second charter of the Gunmakers Company granted in 1672 marked the beginning of the official proving of arms, but it did not apply to weapons made elsewhere in the Kingdom, provided they were not offered for sale in the London market. Revolvers are marked on barrel, on the frame, and on each chamber. By Alain Daubresse. Example of inspectors mark, any letter can be used with a crown. The other side of the coin is that quality can indeed be there in Belgian guns: The Belgian Browning Superposed were all fine guns, whilefirms like Francotte, Dumoulin, or Lebeau-Courallycould make guns of very high quality indeed. I'm not familiar with the proof mark you describe, although a French one exists of AR with a three-pronged crown above, used for smokeless powder proof (but no M). It could be of relatively recent manufacture. Inspector's marks can not be used to establish date of manufacture; they were re-used over time and the significance of some has been lost. Bayet Frres
Quite old. These marks are the Belgian Lion rampant over the letters S.C.H. Smaller gauges progressively cost more, with 20-gauge guns generally bringing at least twice the price of a 12 gauge. If 'JF' it could be Janssen Fils or Frres. Proof Hand Guns 17 Rifles-Shotguns 1 . Courard
Your help is appreciated. . Christophe Henri
[Later note: Gerhard Wirnsberger has written. Very helpfull once again. Closset J.M. In some cases this cipher is also preceded by the figures 16, and followed by a capital B., also surmounted by a crown. Bodson TH. Since it reads >>Made in Belgium<< on the side of the tubes it was made for export. The major countries which either did not have proof or whose marks were not recognized were the U.S. and Spain. production. I can't ID the 'RM', who was likely the barrel maker. JavaScript is disabled. Outdoor Hub, LLC (d/b/a Carbon Media Group), 30800 Telegraph Rd, Suite 1921, Bingham Farms, MI 48025 USA. Greetings Easthampton,I have been researching an old antique pistol that has been in our family for generations.What leads me to your group was the Hits and Misses article posted in 2014; on Deciphering Belgian Proof Marks (my piece has the spelling Belgium). Please note! Any help would be appreciated. Colleye Henri Joseph
Made in Belgium, circa 1890, cracked stock with pistrol grip, old refinish to action. Delcour-Dupont was a barrel maker in Nessonvaux, Belgium. Austrian arms were marked with the double eagle, and later with the letters Wn 78; a variety of private marks of manufacturers are also in use. Some older foreign manufactured firearms, such as pistols from Spain and Italy, will list a location, rather than a manufacturer. Bte" tells us the maker: it stands for "Dieudonn Debouxthay Brevete", or "Patent Dieudonn Debouxthay" in English. firearms. A strong good product that will last for long usage in your
It's very old but I'd like to know more about it. Today's biography is a guest post by our friend Robert White - thanks, Robert! The gun belonged to HH Nawab Ahsanullah. Many thanxPS:. ]v8
>ZX 2Fu}) M Mecar (4 P) Pages in category "Firearm manufacturers of Belgium" Quick Facts Bastin Frres
proof marks. Ancion Jacques & Cie
We have just started to assemble this on going source of Proof Sounds like a 19th C. Belgian pinfire shotgun (grin). Baker, David J. ~JP2lLn)wMO(;%vvRnS>2sw~zG!D""L0MW#+J%d)g"#Q4H&D4&KdU_};g|CN>Is>X&'vqFc&Pkr3EjZ1M&|dv55*6GI?/cOra#2K;cW>rLFtgtycw^4RiK-myVS[${XZw ho"=^f%DeiG wPnD6#diqSg].GI24?>.0 ?~wXy$6Sd3Ln2IdLL_#6)G7OE)7igF. Thank y'all for your help ahead of time! Ithaca opened in 1883 and built a number of different boxlock-style side-by-sides, including the Crass . The lack of chamber length probably means it was made before 1892.Is there a name on it? Mechanicsburg, PA: Stackpole Books, 2008. A fine antique 18th Century Double Barreled English Percussion Sporting Gun by the famous maker Henry Nock London, caliber 14 mm . Smith & Wesson markets gun accessories, handcuffs, safes, apparel, watches, collectibles, knives, tools, air guns, and myriad other products under its brand name, including cologne, handbags, and washing machines. There's no indication of chamber length--but that didn't begin until 1892.The other marks I can't identify.So what can I tell you? referred to more commonly as "Proof Marks", If you could find the time to give me a clue what exactly this gun is I would greatly appreciate it.Thanks,John. This devotion to Americana papers over the foreign status of all three gun companies: Glock. You can tell an unaltered pin-fire by the vertical slot in the breech extending to the top of the barrel (and, of course, the absence of a firing pin). I can't find any other mumbers on the gun other than the multiple proof markings that I will post later. Are also discussed the many markings found applied on the guns and their
A forum community dedicated to Shotgun owners and enthusiasts including the Remington, Beretta, and Mossberg shotguns brands. HI, John. LLH (and other Belgian makers) made the tubes used by most of the U.S. double gun makers 1920s-1940s, with Siemens-Martin or Krupp (by license) steel supplied by Cockerill. CLEMENT, J. Bernimolin & Cap
Second Variation serial numbers 707517-851751 (7,000 produced) - 708921. Bernard Victor & Cie
Original handmade flintlock & percussion ("cap & ball") firearms . Most specimen marks are of this nature, and it is no unusual thing to find the marks of two different smiths upon the same weapon, one man signing the lock work, the other being the barrel maker. Underneath the whole appears the word St. Etienne. Belgian Liege gunmakers (D to F) - Volume 2. The Standard mark for French Government arms was a crown above an E., and this crown has a three looped top, with the orb or ball and cross as ornament, and is so distinguished from the cross-crested crown of some St. Etienne weapons. listed in alphabetical order. Beckers G.
B. Tradename on guns made in Belgium, c.1900. We provide antique gun prices and pictures of each antique firearm we sell. Sorry! Marks, Arsenal & Inspector Marks. . Cap Joseph
I would be grateful to any lover of arms who possesses authentic dated weapons, or has catalogued a private collection, if he would send to me, in care of my publishers, any such information which will add to the mass of fact available. All 31 Belgian gun makers, Belgium dealers and sellers and suppliers Home > Companies Gun & arms makers from Belgium country Czech Republic South Africa Israel Malaysia Netherlands Belgium Norway United Arab Emirates Finland Nigeria Ukraine Hungary Indonesia Lithuania Serbia Slovak Republic Croatia New Zealand Sweden Greece Japan Slovenia Applied to all guns made but not proofed in Belgium - sent to an other country proof facilities. Counet - Genot
thanks for the help so far. Collette Lopold
Members . Sixteen-gauge guns generally fall somewhere in between. No small part of the Belgians' remarkableability to meet the demands of a wide variety of firms trading all over the world was their willingness to go on producing type of guns that were obsolete. Any info will help. Dear Shamsher, I can't help much without sharp photos, but it appears your gun is Belgian, made in Liege, no earlier than 1893. Project Upland. late 1880's to early 1890's, .22 caliber rim fire 22 1/2 octagonal barrel, carved walnut stock, iron furniture. Beuret Frres
Carl, I've checked Wirnsberger's Standard Directory of Proof Marks as well as those listed at Cornell Publications, and came up empty handed. vast quantity of data to treat, the global work was parted in a series of publications,
A forum community dedicated to Shotgun owners and enthusiasts including the Remington, Beretta, and Mossberg shotguns brands. Christophe Louis
Originally evolved by the armourers themselves, the system of proof was in nearly every arms-producing country taken over by the Municipality or the State, who imposed a series of stringent by-laws and penalties on any who sought to evade the prescribed tests. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Miscellaneous ('Manufacturer') Home > Product Catalog Shotguns made in Belgium category Firearms/ Small arms 731 Rifles 237 Shotguns 359 Pistols 134 Blank/Signal/Rubberball pistols 1 Black powder/Muzzleloader 2 Ammunition 3 Ammunition Components/Reloading 20 1870-1898. Mark, I'm unclear what the "leg in a circle" looks like; ditto the "star over the k". Each gunmaker is presented with the maximum
Email: Info@hlebooks.com
Serial Numbers. Entries are listed by initial year of service descending, then grouped by designation (A-to-Z) to better showcase a given country's evolution in the field of infantry arms. Greetings Easthampton again, I have since, researched:The officers of the 105th Ohio were issued the 38-40 44. Heyday of the Shotgun: The art of the gunmaker at the turn of the last century. If you can, send me a photo: ghcox3@gmail.com.Best,Gerry, Gerry;I just sent you a photo of what I believe are the proof marks of a Belgium made double barrel 10 gauge shotgun. The Belgian gun industry in Liege produced flintlock muskets for their African colonies until the mid-1950s. I have pics of the Proof marks I want to show you. However, there are more proof marks that I cannot find on the internet. I found a couple on this site and also nramuseum.com leading me to believe its a British or Belgian gun. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. Bertrand Antoine & Fils
Photos of the flats on the barrels and on the action would help a lot. presented below is the first of the series and is covering the gunmakers whose names are
To my knowledge, there isn't a book out that covers European proof marks: If someone knows about such a book, please add a comment with that information. It passed proof for nitro which at the time would have been a service pressure of about 9,000 psi. To make purchases and use the full site services, register or login your account. Outdoor Hub, LLC (d/b/a Carbon Media Group), 30800 Telegraph Rd, Suite 1921, Bingham Farms, MI 48025 USA. 1860-1870. Rifles & Musket Information. Comblain
Breechloaders had existed previously, but Casimir Lefaucheux's 1835 invention of the pin-fire cartridgea cylinder with a pin extending at right angles to the base which detonated a fulminate charge in the cartridgequickly led to better breechloading systems and to the development first of rimfire and then of centerfire cartridges. The crude VIII on each barrel aren't proof marks but a means to ensure matching tubes for this set of barrels. The date stamps is not used on all guns, otherwise that is the most accurate. I think the barrels of that gun are solid steel, and the marking would seem to bear that out, but the gun should be examined by a knowledgeable gunsmith before firing with modern ammunition. Provisional black powder proof for breech loading guns, since 1924 reserved for smooth bore barrels. It was used by a myriad of hunters for all kinds of wild game. Since 1924 used on all rifled arms. . Today, quality 12-gauge field grade guns from all the American makers during this era can be found and purchased for less than $1,000. into which each separate book is dealing with a small portion of the whole, and that is
Their cipher or mark was the letters G.P. Long Beach, CA: Safari Press, 2000. Burlet
1891 - present 16 Barrel weight in grams of nitro proofed shotguns. The "1136" might be the serial number for that pair of pistols. Bovy Thodore Joseph
Email: ghcox3@gmail.com. be reproduced, in part or in whole, without the written permission of '. Birmingham had also a proof, but this test was not obligatory, and makers evaded the tests. Brancquaert Louis
Would that appear at this location on the piece?What Im attempting to do, is get this pistol appraised; thus the research to discover all the markings. "Any maker's name or place of origin? Debouxthay was a gunmaker in Liege, Belgium, active at least from 1888-1904. date, serial number and property marks as well as various acceptance and My grandfather was a hunter long back in time just after WW2 and I have his shotgun in memory of him. I have a vintage double barrel that I have a few questions about. I think it was made 1890 but not sure. Colot
That last photo will give you an idea of the relative thickness of the stock at the wrist - typical Brit (Belgian) 4 1/8th inch in circumference! Very little: I'm assuming it isn't a muzzleloader but a breechloader, which means it could be as early as 1860-1865, say. 3 vols. So the only indicator of the chamber depth is found with the stamp of the Chamber dimensions? I have tried to look up an 1136 but am unable to locate them anywhere. Black powder proof for rifles and shotguns. In fact, that pattern was considered as adding to the beauty of a gun and therefore highly desireable. Anonymes
Broqua & Scholberg
R. Medina on October 31, 2020: ttn intnl model 1878 s/n 4751. michael v ventimiglia on October 30, 2020: new england firearms ( N G 001039 ) model r22 ultra mini. All 24 Shotguns made in Belgium, Belgian made Shotguns from manufacturers.name.include? Belgian Liege gunmakers
There's no indication of choke--but that didn't begin in Belgium until 1898. I recently decided to clean it up. If not, consider it loaded and potentially dangerous. These include the Search. Boden
The fourth the crossed branches, with the letters S.E.E., and a cross in their angles. Again, thank you Belgium Belgian Proofmarks Belgian proofs are among the oldest and have a very long history. Serial Numbers. It means it's a 12 gauge that has been proofed with black powder. "Cueruy" could be the maker.
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